Topic alimentation prise de masse + protéines

Nexu5 · Inscrit le: Apr 07, 2005 Messages: 277 Localisation: Paris

Très pratique ce topic. Merci Loufpad

loufpad · Posté le: Tue Jun 28, 2005 10:46 am Sujet du message:

C'est avec plaisir

@ kimel : si tu ajoutes avec tes crudités 2 ou 3 tranches de dinde (ça passe bien quand il fait chaud), du thon en conserve et pourquoi pas un oeuf, tu vas les avoir tes prots

Le mieux est que tu te procures une table d'analyse nutritionnelle des principaux éléments

_________________
Le Tour est un jouet... et Armstrong un sale gosse... Il l'a encore cassé !

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loufpad · Posté le: Tue Jun 28, 2005 10:53 am Sujet du message:

MAJ du 1er post avec lien direct vers un tableau d'analyse nutritionnelle des aliments classiques, réalisé par SC

_________________
Le Tour est un jouet... et Armstrong un sale gosse... Il l'a encore cassé !

Un lien dont on ne veut jamais avoir besoin ici : http://www.aidoforum.com/traducteur-sms.php Merci

kimel · Inscrit le: Jun 22, 2005 Messages: 97

loufpad · Posté le: Tue Jun 28, 2005 7:06 pm Sujet du message:

Prenant exemple sur ton topic, je viens de faire le test

Pesée avant séance : 80.1 kg
Pesée après : 81.3 kg

Je ne dirais qu'une chose :

_________________
Le Tour est un jouet... et Armstrong un sale gosse... Il l'a encore cassé !

Un lien dont on ne veut jamais avoir besoin ici : http://www.aidoforum.com/traducteur-sms.php Merci

Nash · Posté le: Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:23 am Sujet du message:

ben.............c'est si t as bu 1 litre et demi , c'est tout a fait normal nan ?
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snoop · Posté le: Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:45 am Sujet du message:

RobertRobert · Posté le: Wed Jun 29, 2005 3:56 pm Sujet du message:

MrFonK · Inscrit le: Jan 14, 2005 Messages: 776

Merci Loupfad pour ce Post It. Il est bien fait. Apres il est vrai qu'al'heure actuelle il n'existe pas de recherche scientifique serieuse et INDEPENDANTE sur la dose exacte de prot a prendre ( les avis divergent allant de 1.2 a 2.5 gr par Kg de poids ).
Quand a Danone, leur but premier est de faire du biz et rien d'autre. Par consequent meme si je met pas en doute la competence de leurs scientifiques, je reste tres perplexe en ce qui concerne l'interpretation de ces données. Bien que cette étude semble plutot raisonnable.

Encore bravo pour tous ces Post It qui sont et vont continuer a etre tres pratique. Cela a du demander du taf et rien que pour ca un grand merci les gars

kimel · Inscrit le: Jun 22, 2005 Messages: 97

Le post-it étant axé sur la prise de masse, il me vient qq questions:

- au vu du post-it sur la sèche, l'élément différenciateur ne semble pas ^tre l'apport de protéïnes qui est à peu près identique; par contre, pour la sèche, il semble qu'il faille surtout réduire la prise de glucides (et de lipides)
- la prise de masse impliquerait donc à l'inverse, outre de manger protéïné, de manger également riche en glucides
- la masse en nquestion serait donc constituéé de masses musculaires mais également de masse graisseuse ?
- est-ce le moyen le plus rapide de progresser en volume musculaire que d'alterner périodes dites de prise de masse et de sèche ? ou bien est-il aussi efficace d'augmenter son volume musculaire sans prise de masse (sous entendu sans prendre de masse graisseuse en même temps,en contrôlant son aport en glucides de sorte de demeurer sec ? ) En BB, bien entendu.
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- KIMEL

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dodoche · Posté le: Wed Jul 13, 2005 11:32 am Sujet du message:

D'abord un petit correctif: le blanc d'oeuf, c'est des prot presque pures, avec très peu de graisse
Quand on veut prendre de la masse, on recherche l'hypertrophie musculaire. Si souvent, en même temps, on prend un peu de graisse, c'est parce qu'on absorbe en excès des protéines, qui sont souvent accompagnées de graisses (dans toutes les viandes). Et de toutes façons, les protéines, même très maigres, finissent par se transformer en glucose puis en graisse, après élimination de l'urée par les reins.
Les glucides sont très importants pour la prise de masse car c'est le carburant directement utilisé par le muscle lorsqu'il travaille. Donc bien se charger en glucides lents avant l'entraînement. Par contre, si c'est le jour de repos, il faut réduire la quantité de glucides, sinon on fait des réserves de graisse
Par contre, la dose de protéines doit être maximale le jour de repos: car c'est à ce moment que le muscle se reconstitue.

loufpad · Posté le: Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:04 am Sujet du message:

Et je rajouterai que les sucres lents doivent être pris BIEN AVANT l'entrainement (lors du petit déj et du déj de midi pour un entrainement à 17h par exemple)

_________________
Le Tour est un jouet... et Armstrong un sale gosse... Il l'a encore cassé !

Un lien dont on ne veut jamais avoir besoin ici : http://www.aidoforum.com/traducteur-sms.php Merci

raygees · Inscrit le: Jul 13, 2005 Messages: 164 Localisation: Paris

Tyler · Inscrit le: Apr 12, 2005 Messages: 560

juste une petite question,dans ce tableau : http://www.letempledelaforme.com/tableau-aliments.html , je ne comprends pas ce qu'est le taux non assimilable??
merci

CedLaBal · Posté le: Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:34 pm Sujet du message:

Hello,
Voici 2 articles tres interessant de l'American College of Sports Medicine, malheureusement en anglais

. Si beaucoup d'entre vous sont interesses, je peux m'atteler à une traduction

Pour une lecture plus facile, je peux aussi envoyer le PDF sur simple PM

eating for strength
and power
by Susan M. Kleiner, Ph.D., R.D.
American College of Sports Medicine
A Quarterly Publication of the
American College of Sports Medicine
ACSM
® FIT SOCIETY PAGE
www.acsm.org ®
NUTRITION

Years ago, planning a diet to gain weight
was easy; just eat a lot of calories. Today
we know that it’s not just calories, but
when they are consumed and where
those calories come from that counts
when trying to gain weight.
A Building Plan
Building muscle requires tremendous
energy: energy to do muscle-building exercise,
plus the energy to build the tissue
itself. In a 1990 study, researchers determined
that the energy requirement for
strength-trainers to maintain their muscle
mass was 44 kilocalories per kilogram
body weight (about 20 kcals/lb). Further
research has shown that to build muscle
and maintain cardiovascular fitness, serious
athletes need at least 52 kcals/kg
(about 23.6 kcals/lb.) or more.
Getting enough calories is important, but
so is consuming the right kind of calories.
The predominant fuel for muscle-building
exercise is carbohydrate. The harder and
longer your workout, the more carbohydrate
your muscles need to store. Once
your muscles are depleted of stored fuel,
fatigue sets in and your workout is over.
The bottom line is that with 500-600
grams of carbohydrate a day, your
muscles will stay packed with enough
carbohydrate to power both strength and
cardiovascular training. To personalize
carbohydrate needs, base your intake on
a figure of eight to nine grams of carbohydrate
per kg body weight (about 3.6-
4.1 g/lb).
At this point you might be wondering,
“What about protein? Don’t I need more
protein to increase my body weight?”
Protein is the basic building material for
muscle tissue, and it is required in higher
amounts in the diets of individuals performing
strength-training exercise. In the
same study that looked at the energy
needs of strength trainers, the researchers
found that during resistance-training
exercise, the subjects required 1.2 to 1.3
grams of protein per kg per day (about
0.54-0.59 g/lb) to maintain their muscle
mass, as long as their energy needs were
met. If the intensity of the exercise was
increased in order to increase muscle tissue,
the requirements were increased up
to 1.5 grams/kg/day (about 0.68g/lb).
However, if calorie intake is reduced to
achieve muscle gain and fat loss at the
same time, then protein needs increase
to 1.8 - 2.0 grams/kg body weight per day
(about 0.81-0.9g/lb).

SUMMER
2002
Diet Plan ---------------------Protein ----------Carbohydrate
Maintain/Adequate Calories 1.2-1.3 g/kg ------8-9 g/kg
Build/Adequate Calories ----1.5-1.6 g/kg------ 8-9 g/kg
--------------------------------0.68-0.73 g/lb ----3.6-4.1 g/lb
Gain Muscle — Lose ---------1.8-2.0 g/kg ------5-6 g/kg
Fat/Calorie Deficit -----------0.81-0.9 g/lb -----2.3-2.7 g/lb
to make room for
extra protein with
fewer calories

Once you’ve determined your carbohydrate
and protein needs, all the leftover
calories come from fat. To keep your heart
healthy, make sure that unsaturated fats
from vegetable oils, grains, nuts and
seeds make up the greatest proportion
of your fat intake.
It’s All in the Timing
When it comes to any form of training, it
is essential to feed your body every two
to three hours, as well as before exercise
and as soon after exercise as possible.
As a pre-exercise snack one to two hours
before exercise, a 200-300 calorie combination
of protein and carbohydrate may
help to reduce the damaging effects of
weight training on your tissues. Foods
like a turkey sandwich, yogurt and fruit,
or even an energy bar, work as good preexercise
snacks.
After exercise, a combination of carbohydrate
and protein within 15-30 minutes
and again two hours later will help your
muscle tissues recover, grow and prepare
for the next time you exercise. Yogurt and
fruit smoothies, a peanut butter and jelly
sandwich and milk, or even meal replacement
products are great choices for immediate
recovery nutrition followed by a
wholesome meal two hours later.
Hydration
Good hydration is essential for strength
training and muscle building. Go into your
workouts well-hydrated by drinking two
cups (16 ounces) of fluid two hours before
exercise. During exercise, drink four
to eight ounces every 15 to 20 minutes.
You may find that a sports drink helps you
stay strong even at the end of your workout.
After exercise, replace any further
fluid losses with at least two cups of fluid.
Another approach is to weigh yourself
before and after exercise. Any weight lost
is fluid. For every pound lost, replace it
with two to three cups of fluid.
The Truth About Supplements
The truth about supplements is that most
of them don’t work very well. But in the
past several years, creatine has gained
notoriety among strength trainers: when
combined with a good diet and strength
training program, creatine has the potential
to give you a slight energy edge during
workouts, resulting in greater muscle
growth.
Sports drinks are also effective supplements
for strength trainers. Using fluidelectrolyte
replacements during workouts
will assist with hydration and maintaining
energy levels throughout an intense
workout. High-carbohydrate beverages
and nutritional shakes are convenient,
portable ways of consuming extra carbohydrates
or as snacks before and after
workouts or competitions.
Hard Work
Even though supplement purveyors
promise easy results, gaining muscle
takes determination, a good diet, and lots
of hard work. Stick to it, and you’ll be
pleased with your results.

Nutrient Intake and Timing Key to
Building Lean Muscle
by Ronald H. Cox, Ph.D.

Resistance training
or weight training is
one of the most
popular forms of
physical activity in
the U.S. The growth in popularity is
easy to understand. Resistance training
is the most effective way to increase
muscle strength and muscular endurance,
though the effects on one’s
appearance as far as alterations in
muscle shape and tone appear to be
one of the major incentives. Obtaining
the greatest benefit from the time spent
on training depends more on effort than
specialized knowledge. To ensure the
best results from a resistance training
program, it’s important to know the
fundamentals, as well as the dietary
requirements.
All successful training programs are
characterized by two features:
• Overload, which means the training is
going to be an effort. If the training
does not require your undivided
attention, it is not an overload.
• Progression, which is the attempt to
increase the poundage, or repetitions
one uses in training.
In general, basic, sound programs also
share these features: 1) all muscle
groups of the body are worked (legs,
back, chest, shoulders, arms, and
abdominals); 2) multi-joint and singlejoint
exercises are employed with an
emphasis on multi-joint movements
(e.g. squats are better than leg extensions)
using 8-12 repetitions and 1-3
sets; 3) the largest muscle groups are
worked first; 4) adequate rest and
recovery time is allowed; and 5) a
balanced diet is maintained.
The fifth component is very important,
but seems to generate the most misunderstanding
and superstition. Often, the
thinking goes like this: I want larger
muscles; muscles are comprised mainly
of protein; therefore I need to eat
excessive quantities of protein. The
primary flaw in this approach is thinking
that what is ingested automatically
makes it to the blood stream and is
incorporated into the muscles. While it
is true that the nutrients from our food
are absorbed into the blood from the
digestive tract, that blood is making a
stop before it heads to the muscles.
The “stop” is the liver, a truly remarkable
organ we usually do not give much
thought. Nevertheless, it has a powerful
role in whether the components of
protein, namely amino acids, stay amino
acids or get changed into carbohydrates
(sugar). The moral of the story is that
eating the protein equivalent of a small
herd of buffalo will not necessary give
you more protein for the muscles, nor
guarantee the muscles will accept it.
The consensus among fitness specialists
is that 1.4 - 1.7 gram of protein for
every 2.2 lbs. of bodyweight is more
than adequate for serious resistance
training athletes, such as experienced
male bodybuilders. This translates to
about 145 grams of protein for a 200-lb.
trainee. Eating an extra six-ounce can
of tuna per day in combination with a
balanced diet would provide this amount
of protein. In short, a 3,000 calorie diet
that is 20 percent protein, 20 percent fat
and 60 percent carbohydrate will meet
these demands very well.
When to eat, so that the muscles are
most receptive to the nutrients, has
been given increasing attention by
researchers. The results are quite
interesting. In one experiment, trainees
were given drinks containing no nutrients
(placebo), a carbohydrate drink, or
a beverage containing 10 grams of
protein, eight grams of carbohydrate
and three grams of fat immediately
following intensive leg training exercise.
The group given the last drink containing
the combination of nutrients showed
a significant increase in the leg muscle’s
use of the protein. In short, the muscle
accepted the protein and used it to build
more muscle. In fact, the entire body’s
use of protein increased. Note that the
nutrient content of the drink is not much
different than that in a glass of low fat
milk.
In addition to eating a light nutritious
snack after training (before training
appears to work also), there are other
times the muscles seem more willing to
use the protein for building up. Keep in
mind that the muscles are continually
breaking themselves down and building
themselves back up throughout the day.
After a long period of not eating (e.g.
after a night’s sleep), the breaking down
aspect seems to be predominate, and
eating a mixed meal of carbohydrates
and protein swings the balance toward
the building up phase. The meal need
not be large. Some scientists have
found a mixed meal of protein and
carbohydrates totaling about 300
calories after a fast accomplished the
change from breaking down to building
up. It appears that moms around the
world are correct about eating breakfast.
In conclusion, train hard, eat a balanced
diet spread throughout the day and treat
yourself to a nutritious snack after your
training sessions. Results will follow.
_________________
Ma fiche de suivie :

http://www.cyberforme.com/membres/fiche-cyberforme-15.htm
http://www.letempledelaforme.com/postp36505.html#36505